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As I sit here and continue to hear how gas prices will continue to rise I can only think how much money the gas companies are making when the rest of the hard working people that buy the gas are hoping they have a job in the next 6 months. But the gas companies say they are really not making that much and that a lot of the profits go into research. One thing that I can do my own research on is rather than having a TV at every gas pump lets drop that gas price a few cents. It is amazing that most gas stations that I go to in DuPage and Will County have TV's at the pumps. Again glad that the gas companies are doing so well, while the rest of us suffer.
 

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gas

hey fire I was really upset about gas profits also till I learned that a ton of those profits are going to everday people who hold investments (stocks, mutual funds, 401k's, etc.). Its OPEC who sets the price per barrel, $18 a barrel when Bush took office, over $100 today. That is where our anger should be directed.
 

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The market sets the prices, OPEC sets the output levels.

High demand = High prices..especially since OPEC wont raise production.


Now, while most people have been trying to adjust to the costs it is becoming very clear that ordinary people are finally getting stretched to thin....to long, to much.

I know my fuel bills are eating at alot of my free money, much more raise in costs and it will start effecting what I put towards savings, if it hasnt already. Putting the Alaska oil reserves off limits greatly reduced our ability to furnish our own oil supply also.
 

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Upland you have some of the thoughts I do. It might be time be start pumping more out of our land and stop waiting to do it. We all understand the ecological strain but where do we draw the line and become less dependent on foreign oil and maybe start to build a few refineries so we have more of a reserve so we don't get hit so hard with every hurricane and political issue that arise abroad? This not my field of expertise at all but we have to change something.
 

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where do we draw the line on oil? Its none renewable, we need to get off the back of petroleum and start looking for alternative means, not destroying Alaska's beauty for a few years of lower priced gas
 

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I understand not destroying Alaska, but we already sacrafice plenty of natural gems for industry now. If we don't utilize our resources we can end up the land of the haves and have nots? All of our prices on just about everything are on the rise and oil is fueling this cause and effect. We for sure need change but with how the politics of all of this works, I don't see it in my life time.
 

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How about drilling in Alaska or off our shores and not destroying anything at all. That option always seems to left out. With our technologies, our foot print would be nothing. I know, "what if there's a spill?? Well, we could "What If" ourselves back to the horse and buggy days for that matter. It's time to stop whimpering about the caribou and start producing our own oil. :)2

Other facts that people do not consider. Exxon did net 40 billion last year but also paid 100 billion in taxes. I believe the average oil company profit on a gallon of gas is about .07 cents. The people making the most money on our gasoline sales happens to be our government as they average .80 cents per gallon in taxes. Thats damn good profit with no overhead. Wonder how many billions that comes to but you'll never hear the politicians saying thats a problem. As a matter of fact, we have a congressman who is introducing a bill for passage that would add a new .50 cent tax to every gallon in the name of conservation. Don't have to tell you his party affiliation do I ?? Let me give you a hint, it's not one of the so-called Bush cronies.

Lastly, when inflation is figured in, we pay less for a gallon of gas now that we did in 1945. With inflation added, we should be paying about 3.65 a gallon. In the 1980's we spent 16% of our family budget on all energy combined, electric, natural gas, fuel, etc. I believe last year came out to 12% of our budget. We live in the greatest country on earth..... EVER!!! yet we spend much of our time trying to convince ourselves how tough it is. With all due respect, the last few generations of Americans (other than our military and their families) have no idea what tough is anymore.

Due to my business and traveling everyday, I fill up every morning, yep 5 days a week. I'm not saying I like the price either but we need to keep all in perspective. We could solve allot of our problems with drilling and refining in our own country. Problem is the same politicians that like to play the energy trump card and the "No Blood for oil crap" are the same politicians that are blocking our production and drilling in this country. It amazes me that voters can't see this hypocrisy. :roll:

Bottom line, if our government wasn't taxing us to death in every area possible, we wouldn't even notice the increase in gas prices. No matter if it's energy, travel, heathcare or anything else, the minute our government says they will help, you'd better grab your wallet !!!
 

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i found this article about alaska oil drilling,i feel the way to solve the problem is to cut back our energy usage by 5% per person and to work on new alternative energy.drilling in alaska wildlife refuge is not the answer to our energy problem the us has 5% of the world population and uses 25% of the worlds energy.if we would be more energy efficient with the energy we use that would go a long way to solving the problem.










Editor's Note: It is virtually impossible to get an unbiased assessment of the campaign to open the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge to drilling. On one hand, the recoverable oil in the refuge, possibly amounting to as much as ten billion barrels, is enough oil to supply the entire needs of the United States for about 18 months.

While that sounds trivial, it isn't - the US consumes about 20 million barrels of oil per day, and at a rate of 1.5 million barrels per day from Alaska, 7.5% of America's oil consumption could be met for over 20 years.

Put another way, this much Alaskan oil could reduce American oil imports by about 15%, American imports from the Middle East by over 25%. The effect of Alaskan oil on helping manage oil prices is significant.

But so what? Americans could reduce oil consumption far more than Alaska can produce oil, simply by eliminating the SUV's commercial vehicle exemptions from fuel efficiency standards, and by developing hybrid technologies, and by aggressively raising fuel efficiency requirements.

What is really at stake in Alaska is the precedent. If the Alaskan refuge is opened to drilling, the California coast and the Rocky Mountains will be next.

If oil drilling was opened up everywhere it has been heretofore off limits, the oil available might increase by an order of magnitude, possibly ensuring American energy security for decades. In the world, more oil would be available to help other nations industrialize. On the other hand, risks to the environment might increase by the same measure. Which matters more, and what alternatives are there? - Ed "Redwood" Ring

Life without cars is impossible.

If you are one of the few without a personal vehicle it is likely you take trips on the subway, bus, train or ferry. Ask almost anyone in the United States about their day and it will involve a car trip along one of the millions of crisscrossing streets that lace America like a giant spider web. Cars rush along the pavement filled with drivers on their way to pick up groceries, take the kids to school, go to work or to go on long road trips.

According to the American Petroleum Institute, there are "70 million more drivers on the road driving about 113 million more vehicles today than there were 30 years ago. Over this same period of time, drivers have increased the miles they each drive by about 44 percent, which means that vehicles traveled per year had increased by about 145 percent since 1970." The increased need for vehicles has come with an increased need for fuel.

Unfortunately, fuel isn't the most environmentally friendly energy source. Anyone who has walked behind a car and choked on the exhaust fumes knows it can't be good for the air. Soon after the first cars left behind the noxious black smoke it became obvious that fuels needed some refining. It didn't take long for the gas industry to develop cleaner technology and fuels. Modern, unleaded fuels are less hazardous and less of a pollutant now. In fact, the U.S EPA [(Environmental Protection Agency)] found that vehicle emissions have declined 41% since 1970 despite the increased amount of vehicles on the road. However, that does not mean that all problems associated with fuel have been solved. Far from it.


The Alpine Oilfield in Northern Alaska
Where it all begins

A major issue is the process of retrieving crude oil from the earth. Pipe leaks, accidents during transport and spills are still commonplace. The American Petroleum Institute claims that many steps are taken to "assure that oil and natural gas can be produced with minimal environmental impact." API also provides some examples: "Directional drilling technology allows us to access oil and gas resources that underlie a sensitive area, such as a wetland, from an area nearby where a drilling rig can safely be located. In the Arctic, companies build ice roads and ice drilling pads that melt away in the spring. Companies have substantially reduced the amount of land disturbance required for drilling a well and by drilling several wells from a single location (with directional or multi-lateral technology) require a much smaller number of sites to achieve the same level of production."

Yet even with impressive technological advancements in the drilling industry, oil rigs and human intrusions still alter the environment and often devastate habitats. Brian Moore, legislative director of the Alaska Wilderness League, knows just how harmful drilling can be. "Prudhoe bay has 400 toxic spills a year," he says with concern, "that's more than one spill a day. These spills don't only affect the drilling site but lands adjacent as well. Devastating effects are real and clear. Environmentalists have not made them up." It is hard to forget the oil covered seabirds, otters and seals that slowly died after 10 million gallons of crude oil spilled from the Exxon Valdez in 1989. Naturally, environmentalists cringe when plans arise to drill in an area full of wildlife. The possibility that drilling may take place in Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR), an area renowned for unique wildlife and pristine habitat, is a shock to any nature lover.

Drilling in the Alaskan Wildlife Refuge will definitely leave its mark. Moore explains that drilling in the refuge will have devastating effects: "Oil exploration is planned to take place in the most critical and sensitive area of the refuge. 130,000 caribou, the last large migrating mammal in the U.S, migrate hundreds of miles to calf here in late May and June, in this one area, and this is where they want to put oil rigs! Gravel roads and drained wetlands are not conducive to them giving birth. It is also devastating to denning polar bears. The polar bear population is already declining and is already threatened by extinction. Oil drilling and extraction may increase the odds of losing the species. Native Alaskans, Gwich'in Indians, whose life revolves around this piece of land will have the most important thing in their culture, the calving ground, taken away from them Gwich'in Indians, rely on the migratory Porcupine Caribou herd as a key source of food and clothing.] It is cultural genocide." To make matters worse, the Refuge constitutes the last 5% of the Alaskan North Slope not open to oil drilling. Drilling operations already exist throughout the rest of the area. The Refuge is the last area wildlife can live peacefully.


North to South - The Alaska Pipeline

The oil industry argues that they will only leave a small footprint in the Arctic, covering a mere 2,000 acres-the size of the Dallas Airport. Yet these measurements do not realistically represent the areas affected by these drilling operations. Vinay Jain, a spokesperson for the National Wildlife Federation, is skeptical of with the oil industry's skewed measurements. "They have said it will only cover 2000 acres," he says, "but the problem lies in the fact that they are condensing. If you realistically measure the areas influenced by oil rigs, it is really spread out. Think of it as a spider web: When the web is spread out, it covers a very large area but when you ball it up it is only a fraction of its original size. They [the oil industry] are giving you the number made up of all the rigs without counting the area in between-the industry is giving you the balled up number. Roads and platforms, these things are all spread out and cause fragmentation of habitat. It isn't just one solid area of 2000 acres, it's much more."

The Republican Party has had an obvious interest in the Arctic refuge's oil wells. As the former owner of Arbusto Energy Inc. and Bush Exploration, American President Bush has always had an interest in oil. Vice President Cheney, also a former oil man, had experience being the CEO of the world's largest oil service company-the Halliburton Company. It is not surprising then, that oil companies have connections with the government. Defenders of Wildlife note that oil and gas firms have donated $1,761,567 to Bushメs presidential campaign making them one of the highest contributors and therefore also the most influential. Exxon Mobil Corp., ConocoPhillips and BP PLC are some of the companies enthusiastic about drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge.


From well to pipeline to tankers bound for world oil markets
A part of the massive Prudhoe Bay oilfield

Recent republican gains in the Senate could give President Bush a real chance of opening the Alaska wildlife refuge to drilling. For one thing, four Republican senators who favor drilling in the refuge were elected early November and replaced Democrats who opposed the proposal in 2003. These new members could make all the difference when voting to drill in the Arctic. There is also a sneaky strategy involved to guarantee success for pro-drilling groups: By attaching drilling to the federal budget resolution it becomes a filibuster-proof strategy. The budget resolution would instruct the House Resources Committee to generate savings over the next few years. This goal would be accomplished by identifying new revenue sources, one of which would be the revenue created by selling oil leases in the Arctic refuge.

Jain is disappointed with the strategy: "It [attaching drilling revenues to the budget] is a fairly undemocratic way of doing things. This is a way of avoiding an honest and open debate. It is not the right way to decide an issue as important as this. A fair and open debate is the proper way to handle this situation and the drilling proposals should be distinct from the budget bill which was never intended for this purpose."

So why is drilling in the Arctic so important? Moore is surprised with the oil industry's interest there as well: "Why are they so interested in drilling in the Arctic refuge? It's hard to understand. It's not about the oil. The House Majority Leader, Tom Delay (R-Texas), gave a speech last year admitting that it's all about the precedent. He essentially said that if we can drill in the Arctic Refuge we can drill anywhere. Opening the Arctic to oil exploration will open other lands for future use by the oil industry." According to Moore, "It starts with the Arctic Wildlife Refuge, and then it'll be Yellowstone, the Grand Canyon or the coast of California. It's not about the oil. The Coastal Plain is the last bit of Arctic coast left. The oil industry would want nothing more than to put a fence of oil rigs around Alaska. Its crazy to me, but it seems that that's what they want. Like a bunch of drunken sailors; they are on a binge and the only thing they want is more oil and more land to suck it out of."

Jain explains that "the amount of oil in the refuge is marginal at best. It is not going to make a difference. Drilling in the Arctic Refuge is symbolic of a larger effort. It's about getting into one protected area and using the momentum to get into another."


Only 5% of Alaska's Wilderness Remains Off-Limits to Drilling
The ANWR portion just happens to be sitting on vast oil reserves.

The Bush administration officials claim that drilling in the Arctic will enhance U.S security by reducing dependence on imported oil. They also promote this controversial venture by stating that drilling will reduce the country's energy shortages. However, very little electrical power comes from oil. Another argument states that drilling will reduce the oil prices. The American Petroleum Institute explains how this would work: "Crude oil prices are established in world markets responding to supply and demand. New discoveries are crucially important to supply. Every barrel of oil produced domestically is one less barrel that must be purchased from foreign sources. In the long term, additional U.S. supplies help to hold down crude oil prices because demand for crude oil from non-U.S. sources is lower than it would be without added domestic production..."

Moore explains that "the argument they put forth is that drilling will reduce our dependency on foreign oil. The Department of Energy, however, stated that if we started drilling today, oil would not reach peak production till after 2020 and if oil is in fact present, it would only reduce oil dependency by about 2%." It is assumed that the oil present in Alaska is not enough to meet even a fraction of America's needs. Projections in 1998 showed a 95% chance of finding 3 billion barrels of oil and a 5% chance of finding 10.5 barrels of oil. 3 billion barrels of oil would barely supply enough oil to last half a year in the U.S. It is hard to believe that drilling in Alaska will benefit U.S citizens since any oil that exists will take about a decade to reach the market and estimates on the amount of oil in the area are speculative. Further more, prices will not fluctuate from drilling in Alaska since the amount of oil found in the refuge is minimal.

Eventually though, there will be no where else to drill when we have exhausted all other resources. Jain believes the best solution is to look for additional energy resources and reduce demand for oil before it gets to that point. "Reducing demand for oil is a better strategy then drilling a pristine corner of Alaska to increase supply, especially when there's relatively little oil there. When we think about ways to meet America's energy needs we tend to turn towards oil, however we can still maintain an American lifestyle with alternative energy. The technology is out there. Hydrogen is something that may be promising years down the road, but in the short term, we can save a lot of oil by making cars more fuel efficient. By simply increasing the average fuel economy by a few gallons we would save much more oil than we would get from drilling in the refuge. The new Honda Accord Hybrid is more powerful than the regular Accord. The idea that you have to give up one thing [power] to be environmentally sound is a false one. You can have a fuel efficient car that is also more powerful. We can't just drill our way to energy independence."

Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge was founded over 40 years ago by President Eisenhower. He wanted to preserve this pristine area. It is a sad fact that congress wants to abandon 44 years of legacy. This wildlife refuge is one of the last pristine areas on earth. Caribou, grizzlies, polar bears, wolves, thousands of birds and countless other animals make this unique area their home. This pristine habitat should not be turned into an industrial zone.

The battle for this area is symbolic and it is important for conservationists and the American public in general to realize this. "This is one of the last pristine areas in America," Jain says, "we know we are not going to reduce gas prices and reduce independence on foreign oil by drilling here. If we can't conserve this tiny sliver of habitat for future generations what does that say about our priorities?"
 

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Nuclear energy plants will dramatically increase the availability of oil products to be used for cars and other industries. Wonder why all the tree huggers and global warming guys don't want us to utilize nuclear energy? These are the same people who are the "no blood for oil" people but they Never have any suggestions, just gripes. The Al Gore types. Nuclear is cleaner, cheaper, more environmentally friendly and yes much safer! Could it be that a lot of people are making big bucks off the oil? Nah.
 

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OK ..... AS FAR AS THE OIL CONSUMPITION THING GOES WE ALL NEED TO CONSERVE, WHEN I SEE THESE GUYS WITH THEIR HUMMERS DRIVING LIKE THEY F..ING OWN THE ROAD WITH THIER MY DICK IS BIGGER THAN YOURS ADDITUDE I JUST THINK, ARE WE SO SELFISH THAT WE CANT SEE PAST THE FACT THAT THERE IS ONLY SOME MUCH OIL OUT THERE! WE OUR PIGS ! ALL WE CARE ABOUT IS ME ME ME.COME ON FOLKS LETS TRY AND TO SHARE THE WEALTH AND THINK OF OUR GRANDKIDS ETC... LEAVE SOME FOR THEM!!!!
 

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horseshoebob hollis said:
OK ..... AS FAR AS THE OIL CONSUMPITION THING GOES WE ALL NEED TO CONSERVE, WHEN I SEE THESE GUYS WITH THEIR HUMMERS DRIVING LIKE THEY F..ING OWN THE ROAD WITH THIER MY DICK IS BIGGER THAN YOURS ADDITUDE I JUST THINK, ARE WE SO SELFISH THAT WE CANT SEE PAST THE FACT THAT THERE IS ONLY SOME MUCH OIL OUT THERE! WE OUR PIGS ! ALL WE CARE ABOUT IS ME ME ME.COME ON FOLKS LETS TRY AND TO SHARE THE WEALTH AND THINK OF OUR GRANDKIDS ETC... LEAVE SOME FOR THEM!!!!
Wow..........All that jealousy has gotten me pumped up. I am gonna go fill my F350 with diesel and act like I own the road with my 2" irish penis. After that I am gonna fire up the pontiac and do some massive burnouts. All in an effort to mask my lack of manhood. :roll:


Relax horseshoe. Don't turn this into a "SUV bash" post.
 

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Sawboy said:
horseshoebob hollis said:
OK ..... AS FAR AS THE OIL CONSUMPITION THING GOES WE ALL NEED TO CONSERVE, WHEN I SEE THESE GUYS WITH THEIR HUMMERS DRIVING LIKE THEY F..ING OWN THE ROAD WITH THIER MY DICK IS BIGGER THAN YOURS ADDITUDE I JUST THINK, ARE WE SO SELFISH THAT WE CANT SEE PAST THE FACT THAT THERE IS ONLY SOME MUCH OIL OUT THERE! WE OUR PIGS ! ALL WE CARE ABOUT IS ME ME ME.COME ON FOLKS LETS TRY AND TO SHARE THE WEALTH AND THINK OF OUR GRANDKIDS ETC... LEAVE SOME FOR THEM!!!!
Wow..........All that jealousy has gotten me pumped up. I am gonna go fill my F350 with diesel and act like I own the road with my 2" irish penis. After that I am gonna fire up the pontiac and do some massive burnouts. All in an effort to mask my lack of manhood. :roll:


Relax horseshoe. Don't turn this into a "SUV bash" post.
Got room in that ole Pontiac of yours. I'll leave my man card at home & tape measure :lol:
 

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Nikster, that baby will seat 7 and still roast em. Anytime you wanna ride, just let me know. Hell, if were born in 1950 or before I will let you drive it so you can recapture the youth and feeling you had driving these cars when they were new.
 

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big saw said:
Nuclear energy plants will dramatically increase the availability of oil products to be used for cars and other industries. Wonder why all the tree huggers and global warming guys don't want us to utilize nuclear energy? These are the same people who are the "no blood for oil" people but they Never have any suggestions, just gripes. The Al Gore types. Nuclear is cleaner, cheaper, more environmentally friendly and yes much safer! Could it be that a lot of people are making big bucks off the oil? Nah.
Nuclear is safer in the short run, but that nuclear waste is gonna be sitting underground for a couple thousand years before it become none toxic; the waste we got already how are we gonna insure our facilities are gonna not leak for a few thousands years.
 
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